BikePGH!

A ride that touches every single Pittsburgh neighborhood

This topic contains 340 replies, has 69 voices, and was last updated by  Lou F. 2 mos.

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mr marvelous

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Jan 29 2012 at 5:05pm #

@ Pseudacris you know we will represent Team Dropped.

@ edmonds59 Pedal Pittsburgh 60 miles plus ridding around town afterwards is my longest day on the bike by the end of the day I put in 100+ miles. Even with rest stops, lots of socializing, and that crazy woman who keeps crashing into me all the time I finished PP in 3 or 4 hrs. We did ride it at a very social slightly faster than Flock pace, I know I could ride way faster.


salty

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Jan 29 2012 at 5:36pm #

Both of those last two setences cannot be true. 3hr/20mph is a pretty ridiculous pace even with no stopping. 4hr/15mph with stops that probably means 17mph moving which I would describe as “hammering” rather than “social”. Flock pace is well under 10mph and often more like 6-8.

I am not fast by any means but I average a bit under 15mph moving in the MS150 and 11-12mph overall (taking a long break for lunch brings the average down a lot). And I suspect this ride will be somewhat hillier than the ms150.


stefb

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Jan 29 2012 at 6:28pm #

Yeah I did the 60 mile pedal pgh and it took me just under 4 hours, and i was going pretty fast (for me)


mr marvelous

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Jan 29 2012 at 7:18pm #

Had to look back at my GPS and I did PP in about 4hrs, the GPS automatically paused at rest stops, or any time I stopped more than a minute, including long traffic lights etc. So I guess I did 4 hrs of actual riding but I don’t remember how long it took including rest stops and stop lights.

(Edit) 4hrs 33min. 28 seconds


HiddenVariable

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Jan 29 2012 at 8:44pm #

incidentally, i’m not sure you guys really grok what 8000 vertical feet is like. it’s probably more than the dirty dozen (i don’t have the dd altitude change in front of me, but i think it’s like 7500?). i think re-tooling the route to stay up high as much as possible, once you get up high, would be better for all involved. as much as that is possible, of course.


urbanrider

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Jan 29 2012 at 8:48pm #

@mattre – i see you even threw in 1.5 mi cobblestone section (Wyoming on Mt Washington) ala Paris-Roubaix. nice touch

@edmonds59 – isn’t Flowers/Tesla combo DD hill #13?


urbanrider

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Jan 29 2012 at 9:34pm #

@HiddenVariable – good point…for reference here are the two rides climbing stats

DirtyDozen

TerribleTour


edmonds59

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Jan 29 2012 at 10:06pm #

I tried to check Flowers/Tesla before I made the suggestion, It sounded familiar, but dannychew dot com has been down today.

I’ve been up it and it has to be easier than going straight up Hazelwood.


Chris Mayhew

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Jan 29 2012 at 10:45pm #

Hazelwood is easier than Flowers/Tesla. Hazelwood is a straight steady 10% top to bottom. Flowers is 8% till the end then 25% ish.

Thought about Bigelow St? One of the best roads in the city, takes you out to the same spot, less steeps grades, just a lot more climbing.


TeamDecaf

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Jan 29 2012 at 10:54pm #

@ Pseudacris and mr marvelous - I’m in for Team Dropped. Considering the climbs involved, I may self-drop long before the 80+ mile finish line, but I’m willing and anxious to try it.


urbanrider

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Jan 30 2012 at 12:42am #

@TDW – Dan, come on I’ve seen you climb some pretty steep hills. Might be that some short sections (~25 miles) of the longer Tour could be used in the coming year’s Team Decaf rides? Not sure if this is possible until the final route is decided on, but this would give riders that don’t want to commit to a longer ride, a chance to do the Tour over a couple of weekend rides.


Pseudacris

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Jan 30 2012 at 12:46am #

^ I like this thought. Break it down into a set of 20-30 mi training/route scouting rides, then string them together on the big day.

p.s. Yay, Mr M & TDW!


mr marvelous

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Jan 30 2012 at 12:55am #

Team Dropped all the way.


mattre

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Jan 30 2012 at 2:22am #

Heh…I was wondering how the reaction to the hills would go ;)

The first draft was more or less a blind following of Erok’s photoshop line on page one. The second one was just a re-drawing of the first with a preference for green bike routes and no attention paid to hills. Now is the time for serious tweaking ;)

I agree with the general consensus that it’s best to avoid busy roads and DD hills, and where possible/reasonable climbs should be reduced (e.g. moving the SS Flats to the final leg and going straight to Allentown from Mt. Wash: http://ridewithgps.com/routes/918102).

I’ll keep playing and add in some of the suggestions and see if I can reduce the number of climbs…should have another draft in a couple of days. In the meantime, it’s put out there as a public file so anyone can save a copy and edit (or export to use in another tool).


Mick

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Jan 30 2012 at 4:46pm #

@teamDecafWeekend Considering the climbs involved, I may self-drop long before the 80+ mile finish line, but I’m willing and anxious to try it.

80+ miles with more total clamb than the dirty dozen?

Anyone else want to make this a two-day thing? Half on Saturday and half on sunday?

Maybe even a three-day Memorial weekend thing?

The neighborhoods were originally defined by topography. In Pittsburgh, Topography = hills + rivers.

That limits the options for smoothing out the ride.


ejwme

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Jan 30 2012 at 5:02pm #

I will train for this. If I ride it, I will walk any hills that look obscene. I like the epic one day thing, but I see the sanity in making it a multi-day ride. Just not sure how day 2 (or 3) will feel after day 1 (and 2).

If for some reason I can’t ride it, and a date is set before I buy summer vacation plane tickets, I will be follow car with gear, rack, food (potluck?), beverages, whatever is required. Will that help make it more feasible for people? If I do ride it, the threat of the hills and exhaustion involved might induce my husband to be follow car for us anyway – schedule will be super important.

It is very important that this happens.


HiddenVariable

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Jan 30 2012 at 5:09pm #

It is very important that this happens.

hear hear!


edmonds59

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Jan 30 2012 at 5:23pm #

I got my butt out on Sunday in anticipation of this. I plan to start biting off segments of this route as soon as possible.

I think a key positive to mattre’s route is that in my mind the most difficult parts are in the first half. A person could ride the first half and easily bail around mile 44. Or mile 50, or anywhere thereafter.

Also personally I could see doing this as a 45 mile ride in the morning with a 36 mile ride in the afternoon, with a 2 – 3 hour lunch in the middle. I would take 12 hours to do this thing and feel no remorse. I am becoming a committed pootler. http://ht.ly/8oDcS


erok

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Jan 30 2012 at 6:05pm #

wow, this really got some teeth. i like the crowd sourced routing of this off of my quick and dirty photoshop.

if this really is 80 miles, taking 10-12 hours to ride this with a group is probably a decent guestimate. Also, if the cue sheet is made, it could also be available at the start for people to ride this brevet style – basically ride at your own pace, alone if you want, with people if you want. the ending could be at a bit more of a public hang out spot like a bar/restaurant, although i like the idea of Spak being on there.

Carry on.


reddan

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Jan 30 2012 at 6:15pm #

One routing suggestion: having several out-and-back legs (like the run up and down Mifflin Rd on the existing map) adds to the fun, because faster riders will be coming back while slower riders are still outbound…gives people a chance to say hi other than at the start and end.


HiddenVariable

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Jan 30 2012 at 7:04pm #

so, i just spent entirely too long making this map, which i think might be of use to anyone trying to get the routing done properly. have a look, and i hope it is of use to someone.


dmtroyer

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Jan 30 2012 at 7:07pm #

whoa


jonawebb

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Jan 30 2012 at 7:39pm #

Hey HiddenVariable, is there some way to make that neighborhood overlay permanently visible to the world? Because I can see all sorts of people finding it useful.

Also, reddan — I was disappointed when you posted and didn’t include a ride report. Taking some time off?


reddan

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Jan 30 2012 at 7:41pm #

@jon: If you’re referring to my few-and-far-between blogular endeavors, I just haven’t had much to say in recent months. (“I rode next to the river today. It was windy.”)

That will likely change this winter/spring.


Swalfoort

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Jan 30 2012 at 8:49pm #

@mattre – I really like your map. But, I can’t seem to make the first 40 miles of the cue sheet appear (or print). No matter what I do with the map, the cue sheet starts with a right onto Williams at mile 41.

What am I doing wrong?


ejwme

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Jan 30 2012 at 9:33pm #

HV, your overlay skills are impressive.

I love maps.

re cue sheets… I have never been able to make them work much for me. I can’t steer/stay upright and read things off paper that I have to hold in my hands. Is this a skill that everyone else has? Or do other people have more useful dashboard accessories than I have?


BradQ

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Jan 30 2012 at 9:44pm #

http://urbanvelo.org/bargain-navigation-system/


ejwme

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Jan 30 2012 at 9:55pm #

Brad, you are awesome. this is going on my bike tonight. Now I just need to bike somewhere I’ve never been to try it out :D


mattre

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Jan 30 2012 at 11:14pm #

@swalfoot: I’m getting the same thing with that version. The only way I could figure out how to edit properly was to export into .gpx and then re-upload, but doing so wiped out the control points on the map…I think it’s making the cue sheet only from the ones I added back in.

For now, use the original version: http://ridewithgps.com/routes/914682. *Drawing* using ridewithgps is as easy as it gets, but I’m finding it to be a bear to edit with. Does anyone have any suggestions of other programs/websites to try?

@HiddenVariable: That is brilliant! It will make verifying neighborhoods so much easier!


Swalfoort

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Jan 31 2012 at 1:14am #

@mattre, have you tried bikely.com?


ieverhart

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Jan 31 2012 at 2:15am #

This makes me think of the Allegheny County Quest. These guys drove around Allegheny County trying to document each and every one of the 130 municipalities here. They list that their next project is a similar quest to visit every Pittsburgh neighborhood but it looks like they’ve stalled out.

http://alleghenycounty.wikidot.com/


mattre

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Jan 31 2012 at 2:55am #

@swalfoort, not yet, but I’ll give it a look tonight.

I had another go at it, using HiddenVariable’s overlay map and Erok’s suggestion from page one that a border street counts as two neighborhoods. I managed to trim seven miles off the distance and eliminated some of the hills while picking up a couple of neighborhoods I missed. I *think* they’re all at least touched now.

Thoughts? It still needs work, but this one is a little better.

http://ridewithgps.com/routes/920535

edit: Looking at the metrics, I see that the max grade has gone up to 32% from 24%. Can anyone see where that happened? I’m guessing it’s somewhere in the South Hills…


Mick

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Jan 31 2012 at 4:15am #

Coming out of Frick Park is 28.8%.

I believe I’ve gone down that road and I dont'; recall it being THAT steep.

There is a function on the graph where you can change it from “Elevation” to “grade” and look at where the grapjh is the highest. I think it’s the Frick exit.


sarapgh2

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Jan 31 2012 at 3:00pm #

For the section from Browns Hill Road over to the bottom of Frick, why not just cut over and use the Nine Mile trail below Summerset to get to Frick instead of climbing all over Beechwood and down Commercial? Unless you want this to be mostly on road. Just wondering.


ejwme

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Jan 31 2012 at 4:15pm #

as a single person riding a bike, I’d normally vote for trails over Commercial, hands down.

in a group, I think it might be safer to take Commercial, depending on time of day and day of week. If it’s prime “take the dogs/kids to the park” time, getting a group of cyclists through the park on the trails around leashes and families could be tricky, especially if the group is strung out enough for people to let go of their little ones between cyclists.

(in my head, there’s a large, thumbed, responsible creature trying to restrain an incredibly enthusiastic, flexible, and strong smaller creature from the Object Of Intense Desire across the speeding cyclist filled trail, with a potentially horrible ending… perhaps this is a statistically unlikely event, but I cannot help but identify with all parties in the situation enough to wish to avoid it.)


sarapgh2

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Jan 31 2012 at 5:24pm #

ejwme, I can understand where you’re coming from with that. I’ve never been on that trail at a “peak” time, so it’s always deserted for me.

Personally, I never ride down Commercial, solo or with a group. Way too crazy. This cut through takes out some of the elevation change, it’s basically flat instead of climbing up to Beechwood then coming back down Commercial.


Nate

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Jan 31 2012 at 5:50pm #

Six months ago I was messing around with some google mapping tools + js, and had something that worked the way I wanted it. But I never got it hosted anywhere. Right now I don’t think I can get google sites to run javascript, so all have at the moment is this woeful prototype. If I have something else worth looking at I’ll link it in the next few days.


HiddenVariable

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Jan 31 2012 at 7:09pm #

Six months ago I was messing around with some google mapping tools + js, and had something that worked the way I wanted it.

nerds of the world, unite!

also, if anyone wanted to solve that graph traversal problem mentioned a few pages back:

Ah, but can you so arrange the ride so that you visit each neighborhood once and only once?

(well, a subset of it, since there are more than two neighborhoods that are accessible by exactly one other neighborhood.)

i (geez i don’t even want to say this) hacked up a csv file containing an edge list of the connections between pittsburgh neighborhoods. feel free to find the minimum spanning tree, or the most “central” neighborhood. or whatever else.


TeamDecaf

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Jan 31 2012 at 7:12pm #

To All

Sorry this post is so 24-hours later

@ urbanrider

Great to see you posting on the board, and great idea about making several Team Decaf rides from pieces of the whole.


ieverhart

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Feb 1 2012 at 1:39pm #

a group of cyclists through the park on the trails around leashes

Good news/bad news!

Good news: I often ride through Frick Park and it is never a problem because of leashes stretched across a trail.

Bad news: That is because dog owners almost always (illegally) let their dogs run uncontrolled as the owners walk through the park. I usually have to slow way down (no more so than for oblivious pedestrians) but occasionally I am concerned that a dog is going to run out in front of me and make me fall and/or bite me.

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