BIKEPGH MESSAGE BOARD ARCHIVE

Saw an ambulance at the bus stop there a bit before 5:30. There were also some kids (teens?) milling about with bmx bikes.

Of note: that's the stretch of Butler that the new bike lane is on.

Added one response to the first troll to show up.

Hate to threadjack, but has anyone else noticed there are ALWAYS cars parked in the new bike lane in front of the main cemetery entrance? Does calling 311 accomplish much?

That is by far my least favorite intersection during my commute home. To stay on Butler at that intersection you must transition from the bike lane and cross the right turn only lane. This seems to confuse / frustrate motorists.

"That is by far my least favorite intersection during my commute home. To stay on Butler at that intersection you must transition from the bike lane and cross the right turn only lane. This seems to confuse / frustrate motorists. "

_______________________________________

I agree that that intersection is really dangerous for that reason.

Sorry, I couldn't help myself. I had to respond to that troll in the PG comments.

+1

Please, someone, get screen shots of some of this stupidity. One of these days, one of these idiots is going to tangle with the wrong cyclist the wrong way, and will have some serious explaining to do in front of a judge and jury.

anti-cycling trolls on the unmoderated PG comments section?

brb, gonna call Ripley, he wont believe it.

/facepalm

Yeah, today was my first day commuting home via that stretch since the bike lane went in, and I agree, it's rather tricky when there's lots of traffic.

It also doesn't help that there are still signs from when there used to be right turn lane.

Wear your elbow & knee pads and get a freaking permit, scofflaws.

I'm Entitled to My Cager Dividend!

I've noticed that folks who don't like to share the streets with bikes always go on about how cyclists should have to get a license and pay tax, insurance, or whatever. Would that really make them happier? Most people on bikes probably have a car too so they're paying anyway. I just never understood that reasoning.

The tax and licensing stuff is just a way to point out our second-class status.

Larry, I agree. If I license my bike does that make it safer? I am pretty sure I pay enough for my two cars.

I HAD a friend who railed against bikers all the time. Told me I was stupid for riding a bike and was going to get hit by a car. Said they don't belong on the road. We don't talk so much anymore.

Q, I was happily drifting along staying away from the comments section, and now I'm pissed, so thanks for putting that up.

I'm just worn of debating assholes.

I wish one of the national bike orgs would do some research to show exactly how much it would cost states to impose fees and/or licensing what effect it would have 1. ridership 2. bike facilities 3. public perception.

Warning, half-baked brainstorm: Maybe we should start an opt-in bike fund (like a fee but not mandatory) here in Pittsburgh so we can say we pay into the system. It'll be easy. You donate, say $10 to us and earmark it for the fund (actually let's call it the FUNd). We then make a big splash by working with city council or the mayor's office to write legislation to encumber the FUNd, making sure all this money is earmarked for the City's bike program to put in more infrastructure. In return we arrange a date/time for you to get your photo taken at our I <3 My Bike booth, take your serial number/info so that you have it in case your bike gets stolen. We also give you a sticker that says either "I bike. I vote." or something like "I pay in."

Again, half-baked, and who knows how much we could actually raise. It wouldn't be worth giving to the city if it's less than $25,000 or so.

I love the idiocracy of arguing about paying for the maintenance of roads. Of course a 2000 pound vehicle is going to create more damage to the road then a 200 pound bike/person. What do they think makes those 2 worn down lines down the lane of a road? Two bikes riding side by side with gi-normous tires?

Fine, tax me...what's it going to cost? Let's see my bike and I are probably less than 10% of the weight of a vehicle, so let's say I pay 30 bucks for vehicle registration so my bike will be about $3 a year then maybe another $4 for "inspection". But then what other taxes am I paying? I don't pay for gas, I don't create emissions.

F off asswipes. Glad I'm not a member of Facebook to start commenting

Bike licensing is dumb, it would turn into dog licenses....you pay one year then forget then never do it. It would be nearly unenforcable without draconian measures to enforce (high fines, high risk of being caught). Cops pulling over group rides blah blah blah.

Anyone want to put a big orange 2013 bike registration sticker on their new bike?!

I pay plenty of taxes/registration/etc and it is none of their business. The registration is a diversion. I don't have to have a purpose or destination to get on my bike and ride it on the road and I don't need to explain it to anyone because it differs from their world view. As I said, I paid.

And the buzzing/harrassing of cyclist is unbelievable. I had a guy jaywalk between cars (without helmet, lights or reflective clothing) right in front of my car before 7 AM this morning...I saw him, slowed and let him cross. I neither honked, cursed nor buzzed him. It seems simple, all I ask is that they not think of it as car to bike but instead provide some common courtesy human to human.

I'd rather not do anything that implicitly lends legitimacy to that bogus argument. It's been debunked repeatedly and yet idiots like Mr. Zacovic keep repeating it.

I'd rather go out with a pedal-powered road crew and fix potholes. High-visibility and direct benefit to all road users.

One retort I haven't seen or used yet is to say, as a car driver and a bike rider I would support a VMT or gas tax hike to actually fully fund the system. As it is the entire system is underfunded because car drivers don't pay in enough.

@scott-- re "your half baked brainstorm:" I think salty has made a good point. It can appear that you are legitimizing Mr. Zacovic's by simply responding to it, even in this way.

Road damage is modeled as the fourth order of axle weight. So a (average) 4000 pound car causes 20^4 or 160,000 times as much damage as a (kind of heavy) 200 pound bicycle + rider. If the license fee was based on that ratio, no problem. Oh yeah, we'd also have to pay for some paint, for bike lanes.

I think we should just go out and paint our own bike lanes like the person did with the crosswalk the other week. Then maybe the city will remove them and put in legit ones!

I also think these morons should shut the fuck up and try riding a bicycle for once. Probably will have a heart attack and die from physical activity. then we won't have their stupid asses around anymore. More realistically, let's find out where they live or work, get our helmet cameras, and ask them in person to say these things to our faces! Then watch them as they can't win a logical argument. Then we'll post it in the comments section and show it to their employers, co-workers, and friends. Someone in their social circles are bound to be cyclists. Unfortunately, there are too many morons that it would take forever to find them all.

I survive on the hope that the number of hard core morons is finite. Futile, I know.

The driver of this truck threatened me on Millvale Avenue bridge about 935 this morning:



Did not get a picture of the driver, but he was a white male, late thirties or early forties, with another white male in the passenger seat.

Heading southbound on Millvale (toward Oakland), driver passed me within three feet. I held up my hand with all four fingers extended and yelled "four feet!" He stopped, tires screeching, and waited for me to catch up, and I said again "Four feet, you have to give me four feet". He then drove alongside me yelling at me, within arms reach and getting closer, while I repeated "you have to give me four feet". He eventually tore off down Millvale, only to be stopped at the Baum Blvd light, where I took the picture above. He then turned right at the red light at Centre (without stopping, I'd add); I last saw him heading up Centre into the Hill.

I did call 911 to file a report a few moments ago, when I got to my desk; haven't heard back.

(ETA: Spoke with Officer A. Chambers at my office at 11am; he said he would have a ticket mailed to the driver.)

If I had to guess, I would bet that the majority of those who advocate for bicycle fees and regulations are also the same people who argue for reduced gum'mint interference in private affairs.

That, and it's a false argument, Stu. They frame it as though only people that "pay into" the system via taxes and fees, etc. have a "right" to them. The municipal authority provides the roads for the public good, not just "taxpayers."

So anyway, does anyone know if the person injured is OK?

> The municipal authority provides the roads for the public good, not just "taxpayers."

+1000000 This needs to be blown up big and bold on all these stupid arguments.

Does anyone have pictures from before/during when they resurfaced the bottom part of Beechwood? The disparity between the constant potholes in the car lanes and the perfectly smooth bike lanes (which they did *not* repave) was pretty striking.

Scott, you are 100% correct and that's what makes this crap about "cyclists don't pay for the roads" even more irritating because the truth is drivers don't pay for the roads. I've posted this report several times. $30B transferred from the general fund to the highway trust fund since 2008:

http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d10780.pdf

Drivers don't pay for roads AND drivers don't follow laws such as speed limits and stop signs very well.

I personally think all cars should be banned from all roads until every driver starts following every speed limit.

Samuel Jackson Public Service Announcement: Slow the F*** Down

Two comments.

@stu -- Ah, the lack of critical thinking in today's masses. If you really wanted to get hard core about it, you could argue that any regulation or licensing by the state is an impingement upon our inherent right to travel from one place to another. (I am NOT saying I agree with this, just that I have seen the argument made.) I think if you choose to look at it this way then the only question is where you think any line should be reasonably drawn and why. In the case of cars you probably could justify it with saftey concerns because of the potential damage a car can cause due to its size and weight. But bicycles -- that's a different matter. The risk variables that drive any need to regulate for safety are totally different from a car. It's an apple to orange argument and as others have said, it's bogus. Idaho stops are an example.

Second, I think we need to be careful here with the source of funds argument. Governments have to get their money from somewhere. The only way they can do it is by transferring wealth from one person/entity to another through taxation at some point. This seems to be true whether we are talking about road and fuel taxes, general fund appropriations, the highway trust fund or whatever. (The federal government is different only because it can borrow/deficit spend and send the bill to our kids and grandkids to repay from THEIR taxes.) So, yeah, these people are right that the taxpayers pay for this but they miss the fact that all cyclists do also to the extent they pay taxes just like car drivers and everyone else. More lack of critical thinking skills, I guess.

New Tax! Link cars & cell phones so that each time you text while driving $1 gets transferred to Scott's FUNd.

Or, $1/fb comment.

From another board is sounds like another accident has occurred. No news coverage I can find yet.

Here's an awesomely sarcastic article from a British trade publication... would love to see something like this appear in a Pgh. paper. (It never would.)

I know I'm preaching to the choir but the comments about bikes not paying their fair share of taxes irk me to no end. In our society somebody is always subsidizing somebody else with taxes, but I would be hard pressed to identify something that receives as many direct and indirect subsidies as automobile use. I will list just a few, off the top of my head: the automotive bailouts, the Cash for Clunkers program subsidizing new car purchases, gas taxes and vehicle registration fees which aren't adjusted for inflation or anything else, mandatory minimum insurance coverage levels set unrealistically low given the financial costs of accidents (thus pushing the uninsured/unrecoverable costs of accidents back on the public), laws which make it difficult or impossible to collect certain assets from drivers who cause damages, endless global politicking to keep the oil flowing, endless building and rebuilding of underused roadways, corn subsidies for ethanol, and who knows what else, ad nauseum. If all of these subsidies, both direct and indirect, disappeared tomorrow I would open a bike shop ASAP because about half of this country would probably not be able to afford to drive!

Any further info on Tuesday's collision victim or the event that Lou-M referred to? TIA!

last post on this thread at nevertellmetheodds.org says "today's bicyclist is fine. I think he just got clipped."

I always thought there was an unspoken rule about invoking that name in public? Fact or myth?

You're supposed to pretend that you've never heard of it if someone mentions it.

i thought it was just that the name is so bloody long nobody wants to say or type the whole thing.

Update on injured person??

See Quizbot's post above. Doesn't seem serious.

That's a different person, we haven't heard anything about the original one.

Also a coworker of mine got right hooked this morning in the N. Hills. I don't want to post too many details but he's basically ok. It was a hit & run.

@salty - I am trying to log bike accident reports. Can you PM me a location and time for your co-worker's incident this morning? Or report it on the Bike Pgh Crash Map? That way we'll have a record that SOMETHING happened at xyz location during daylight with good weather conditions. Oh, and hit and run! Thanks!

As always, try to get them to fill out one of our online reports

http://map.bike-pgh.org/main/newCrash

This FUNd sounds a lot like Bike Pittsburgh membership to me...