BIKEPGH MESSAGE BOARD ARCHIVE

It's not that bad out there.

Keep it steady, take the lane, and favor nominally plowed streets over trails that are icy ruts with 2 inches of powder on top.

seems i missed your 5 min timeline, but I just drove my husband to Duquesne University because my BFF just had a baby and I need to go see her after work (everyone together now....awwwwwwww). Anyway, biking would have been better, for my drive at least, than driving and a ton better than walking.

You guys were all the encouragement I needed! Thanks!!!

(5 min x's 6....)

I made it! It really wasn't that bad. I know there will be more snow this afternoon, but if it's REALLY bad I can always throw my bike on a bus.

Rule #9: If you are out riding in bad weather, it means you are a badass. Period.

studded tires make a world of difference. i went pleasure riding yesterday in schenley around 5 and it was awesome. todays commute from polish hill to east liberty was a breeze. ive gotten to the point now that when i see it snowing pretty good i get excited to ride. goggles are a must for me, though.

I rode my bike today with semi-slick tires (though I only have roads to commute on). It wasn't bad just muddy!

If you need more encouragement, 3 other co-workers rode their bikes to work today too. And on my way to work, I ran into 2 other cyclists on their way to Downtown as well.

So that makes... 6 "badass" cyclists

So, perhaps we've found another collective noun. A badass of commuters...

anyone else use goggles? i've been thinking about getting some, since i wear glasses and they fog up, and my eyes start to water in the wind and i begin to have trouble seeing the road or maintaining my usual high level of situational awareness. are they awesome? what makes a good pair? do they restrict your peripheral vision overmuch? other thoughts?

they restrict my vision a bit, but i feel that being able to look up at the road vs slightly down to avoid snow is a big plus. my only problem is that my goggles are wearing out and the anti-fog coating is almost gone so i cant wear my ninja mask any more. also my bern helmet kinda sucks for holding the goggles in place. the strap wants to slide too far up or down.

Made it to Forest Hills just fine today. Studded tires rule! Nothing compared to last year. Definitely a cup-of-coffee-in-one-hand day.

HAVE to have goggles when it's snowing like this. I remember before I used them, all my co-workers thought I was ultra-stoned all the time because my eyes would be so red from the stinging ice.

Only bad part about today: I don't use a front fender, so I had a massive chunk of salty, gritty black ice flung into my mouth while I was climbing a hill.

Trying to make this winter a "flawless victory" in terms of not falling... knock on wood.

I rode today, as did several of my coworkers. Although I made the dumb decision to try riding in the snow-covered bike lane down the hill. When I came across some deep snow mixed with tire tracks @15-20mph, it definitely got pretty hairy for a few seconds.

Although, I was motivated to go in the bike lane after I had two assholes pass me WAY too close. The jackass in the Jaguar with some stupid vanity plate was the worst - first she nearly hit me trying to force her way past me on the downhill part of Wilkins between Shady and Beechwood, then when we made the left on Beechwood, she did barely force her way past despite all the muck.

I biked.. on the north shore trail some, on the road behind all the industrial buildings some. I do like that the casino keeps their stretch of the trail immaculate. The were running the snowblower in fron of the science center, and the trails from the science center to downtown had been plowed during the night but had an inch or two reaccumulated. From the casino to the penitentiary hadnt been touched except for the other two sets of bike tracks I saw.

Snow was 4-8 in deep on the trail, just put in a low gear and spin it like going uphill. I do love my studs in the snow, they are slow tires in the dry tho.

Since I have the option of working from home, I've found I am now soft about riding in the snow. I enjoy riding in the _snow_, but I do not enjoy riding in the muck that covers the city streets. I am blissfully watching the white stuff swirl outside my bedroom window.

I also figure, after 10 years of year 'round commuting, I've got nothing left to prove

A badass of commuters...

I like it!

On goggles, I used my ski mask today combined with a tossle cap (under the helmet) and a scarf wrapped around my neck/mouth. It didn't fog up really and kept my face warm. Took out a little of my peripherals but it wasn't too bad. Plus it cast everything in a warm orange-y glow...

I also figure, after 10 years of year 'round commuting, I've got nothing left to prove

bjanaszek, you are "badass" official! Nothing to prove for sure.

At motorcycle stores I've seen sunglasses with a foam seal like a goggle, that might be something to try. Might be easier to deal with than strap goggles, with the helmet and whatnot. just a thought.

http://www.amazon.com/Powersports-Motorcycle-Padded-Sunglasses-Goggles/dp/B001TNU994/ref=pd_sbs_a_2

I rode to work at 6:30 with a cross tire in the front and a 23c in the back (cross tire won't fit with the fender I have)--I would have been fine with a 23 up front, too. It was fun, minus forgetting my goggles.

I had a blast riding home from work last night. The only problem areas I had was where the snow was compacted by car tracks. My fat mt. bike tires wanted to float on top of the snow. Whereas the snow that was not touched was easy as pie to plow right through.

I've only used goggles for skiing, never occurred to me to use them while riding the bike. thats a damn great idea!

Yellow lenses are probably a best bet. They seem to increase contrast in cloudy/dark conditions. And if you're wearing goggles it is usually because snow is falling (cloudy) and winter = less daylight hours (dark).

bjanaszek, you are "badass" official! Nothing to prove for sure.

Ah, shucks.

I had a pair of those goggles that had a seperate lens for each eye and foam seals between the lenses and the face (picture sunglasses with foam seals and a strap instead of ear peices) and they were no good at all! they were o.k. as long as I was moving and cool air was streaming over them but as soon as I slowed down they would fog up completely and I couldn't take them off while riding because the strap was under my helmet. Got rid of 'em.

I now ride with lightly tinted sunglasses (even at night)almost exclusively or good 'ol ski goggles when the snow is really flying.

I just wear my standard interchangable lens tifosis, just something to keep most of the wind and snow out.. normal I ride with the reddish lenes for contrast and glare except at night when I just the clear ones.

Maybe I don't ride too fast, but I only use my balaclava when temperature drops down to the 10's. For 20's and above my face gets too hot with it, so just wear a knit hat under my helmet, a scarf, and that's it -let the wind & mud in.

One thing I do when I go outside to ride, I rub my eyes vigorously. That helps making the transition between interior warm to exterior cold & wind. I do wear glasses too (presciption, that is).

I have a pair of Smith goggles with a strap that has a clasp in the back--makes it really easy to wear with a helmet. I have a blueish kind of mirrored lens in it now. It's great for daytime, works for night too (I can't find my yellow lens...).

I use a smartwool neck gaiter for riding below 25.. works nice at the beginning of your ride covering your lower face.. then once you get warmed up.. just pull it down below your chin.

I wear a t-shirt over my head (think cornholio). It keeps the snow from going down the front of my jacket and the wind off my face. The elastic in the neck of the shirt lets me pull it up over my nose and when I get too hot I can pull it down to my chin.

"I wear a t-shirt over my head (think cornholio). "

This is one of the best things I've ever seen on this board.

I rode in today too, on what I guess is a cross tire, down Butler/Penn and it wasn't too bad. All I can say is hooray for full fenders. The roads were covered in gray slush, and I still managed to say clean and dry.

Also, Rule #9 is the best - it keeps me going in the worst of weather. Period.

I muscled my way down the unplowed Eliza Furnace Trail. Ugh. Even more tricky on the slicks on my bike. I have some tires with a bit of tread in my car that I haven't switched out yet. Should have done that last night.

Don't have fenders so on my ride home I had about a half an inch of snow and slush on my shins before the weight of the road detritus overcame the frozen stickiness of the ice and fell off.

"I wear a t-shirt over my head"

T-Shirt Ninja!

http://www.instructables.com/id/ninja-mask-with-t-shirt/

There was a sweet picture by Darrell Sapp on the mainpage of the Post Gazette this morning of a cyclist commuting past the fountain by the frick fine arts building. I'd post it if I could find it...

I rode.

Only about 2 miles though.

Earlier this week there two other bikes takng the two prime rack ends (What are they? F**king crazy riding in this weather?), but today I had my choice of spots.

The road wa mainly OK, but there are some places with a an unpredictable treacherous 1 inch layer of ice/hardpack. A nice challenging mixture of ruts, breaks, ands smooth ice parts.

The cattle chute on Fifth should be approached with caution. No, really. Even more caution than than

I rode more slowly than normal for me. Hard to believe.

I told myself what a badddd assss I am and that helped considerably.

last night as I was driving away from the shuttle stop, I passed the only other bike-commuter I've seen at (W). We've talked in the past, he does about 1.5 miles (always either walking or biking). I was insanely jealous, until I saw he was walking his bike. When I paused to check he was ok, he said "I'm fine, just walking to stay dry" At which point I replied "Awe, man, you gotta get some fenders!!" We commiserated over our mutual lack of cycling at the moment, then I drove on, for in my car I was truly holding up traffic.

At the same time, Monroeville, Plum, and Penn Hills didn't get to clearing the streets in time for my return home, there is no way I wuold have made it on my tires. I was moving at bicycle pace last night in my car and came very close to simply waiting it out several times.

I'm working from home today in an attempt to get things done - it's working, mostly, when I stay away from here...

the only thing i really dislike about riding in weather like this is the complete inability to read the streets. i have to go by memory to avoid potholes and such. and of course, they're even bigger now.

found the photo @sloaps mentioned:

awesome pic, indeed!

for those with goggle strap problems, i suggest using a ski/snowboard helmet as a winter helmet. less vents, usually with removable plugs, a clip to hold the goggle strap in place, and ear flaps which in some cases are removable. i <3 my giro g9! it even has pockets in the ear flaps for headphones.

boy did i get stuck in traffic on Second Ave last night on my way home. I only had road tires so the jail trail was a futile exercise. At least the lack of fenders didn't matter when you're going that slow.

this morning the hilly trails proved quite the workout, it took me 1h 15m to 9 miles. at least it was more fun in the powder than in the road muck.

I gotta say, today must have confused the living daylights out of my boss...

(mini-rant coming up....)

my opening baker called him an hour after she was scheduled saying she couldn't get her car out and her bus didn't come, so he called me to see if I could get in - I said, yeah, give me 15 minutes to get dressed and 30 to get there. He says, "Oh, you're walking, right, I forgot," and I said, "No, I'm riding my bike." He said, "......oh."

I got ready in 15 minutes, left, rode down, bike lanes were terrible, I was at half my regular speed. On Spring way, I was moving slowly and fell over, then stopped and called 311 before continuing on penn ave. Still made it to work in better time than normal. 25 minutes.

I wanted to flip out on the girl who was supposed to open ("You have a CAR. I have a BICYCLE. WTF."), but that's another story.

Anyway, I gotta say, I expected more salt on my pantlegs - my rear rack works well as a fender, but I've got nothing in the front, and my legs are usually soaked by the time I arrive anywhere.

On the subject of goggles, I could use some. But I still do okay without. At least I don't have to ride straight down Arlington/Josephine with shoddy brakes and limited visibility this year (How I survived last winter is beyond me).

Someone shouted out a car window at me as we both were going up Baker St. toward Morningside: "You are a badass!" White car with a roof rack. Anyone who posted here? heh heh.

These goggles from Portland Design Works are actually really sweet for snowy weather.

So, perhaps we've found another collective noun. A badass of commuters...

Excellent.

I use ski goggles (I was thinking, skiers also want to be able to see pretty well in fast-blowing wind and snow.) and I love the occasional double-takes they induce. I put them on over a balaclava and boom, I'm pretty warm most of the time. I ordinarily wear clear protective work glasses at night but they kept fogging up when it's cold out. These fog up too, sometimes, but far less.

Someone with a little silver suv, maybe an older model honda crv gave me a few friendly beeps around 9:45 this morning inbound on Panther Hollow Rd. They had a nice hitch bike rack like a Saris T-Rax or similar, which is why I assumed it was friendly beeps, rather than get the f-out of my way beeps.

@quizbot Huzzah!!! Darrell Sapp is epic.

I bussed it to work the past 2 days. Gonna hop on the bike tomorrow. Has anyone been doing the bike lanes or sidewalks on Forbes from Frick Park to Sq Hill?

I had a nice quiet ride to work through the Allegheny cemetery today. The snow wasn't so much plowed as it was packed down on the main road, making it pretty slippery. I was also pulling my BOB trailer so I took it pretty slow. Most of the secondary roads where untouched though. There had to be about 4 inches of nice fresh powdery snow to fly into.Some of the steep hills where untouched. Lots of fun to slide down. I hope there is a few more inches of fresh snow on the ground before I leave for work tomorrow.

You got your wish. 2" extra since 11 PM, at least in Brighton Heights.

I've been enjoying the bus this week.

@Pseudacris Bike lanes on Forbes from Frick to Squirrel Hill are mostly snow as of this morning, but there's enough room just riding the white line. Just stay to the left. The sidewalks looked worse.

Ride to greentree was pleasant with a few detours. I took the pavement up Poplar to Mansfield because the sidewalk looked hideous. Shockingly wide passes from motorists.

i seem to be the only one using the rack today outside newell simon hall, but i've seen a few folks on bikes the last few days, and the bike room at my gf's place had another bike covered in salt with puddles underneath it (and some sweet gloves i wanted to ask about, but alas!).

i wish i had little stickers or sticky notes that say "badass!" to put on people's saddles when i see their bikes parked after obvious snow use.

Thanks, miasme for the report on Forbes. I took it in after rush hour late this morning. The only place I could ride in the bike lane was the curve near the community garden in the cemetery. I skipped the trails and took Forbes & Fifth all the way into downtown from the Regent Sq area.

I'm definitely getting more comfortable taking the lane.

That PG photo is great!

Maybe I don't ride too fast, but I only use my balaclava when temperature drops down to the 10's.

I wish I could find my balaclava (not to be confused with the tasty layered greek pastry). The scarf falls down and kind of restricts my breathing.

The studded tires are working very well! Yesterday I biked from Garfield to work in the South Side, to Penn Brewery, then back home again. No problems.

The only thing I wish I could figure out for cold weather gear are the gloves. My fingers can never stay warm. I'm wondering if I should invest in some smart wool liners to go underneath my snow gloves?

For when the snow gets deeper:

I picked up a cheap set of glove liners and they definitely help.

I've also found that curling my fingertips back under the bars (as opposed to keeping them on the brake levers pointing straight into the wind) helps a lot. Of course, there are a lot of times where I still want my hands on the brakes, but a fair amount of the time I feel ok keeping at least one hand just on the bars.

The best gloves in my arsenal are the cheap fleece/Thinsulate models that some older relative got me for Christmas many years ago. They are comfy down to about 10-15 degrees.

I've also borrowed department store ski gloves, and found them very good, too.

Cold fingers have been an issue for me, too. However, glove liners under lobster claw novarras have been great *****especially when coupled with Mick's advice to keep the core temperature up***. (thanks, Mick)

I have a pair of what were once killer warm goretex ski gloves with a fleece liner, but over the last few years they just don't keep my digits warm anymore. I have been wearing a newspaper plastic bag with the thumb sticking out lately, which does the trick. Looks funky, but my fingers can't see. Eventually they tear, but I get a new one delivered to my driveway every day!

Photog's love bikes in snow.

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE70B42420110112

The only thing I wish I could figure out for cold weather gear are the gloves. My fingers can never stay warm. I'm wondering if I should invest in some smart wool liners to go underneath my snow gloves?

I got some glove liners a few weeks back and I guess they make a difference, but I have the strange experience of alternating just fine/warm hands to terrible/cold hands on the same ride. Maybe core temperature is it.

A girl at school asked if it was me she saw riding on Fifth Avenue yesterday morning. I said yeah, it could have been me in a bright orange jacket. She said she figured it was me, since "who else would be riding a bike in 20 degree weather?"

"Another awesome person," I replied.

Nope, I don't have an orange jacket.

Musta been you.

I was thinking recently of taping my metal brake levers with some electrical tape or something to insulate my fingers against the bare metal, which obviously saps a lot of heat from my gloves. Seems to make sense... imagine riding in the winter on unwrapped bars. Anyone ever do this?

Hmm, seems like rechargeable electrically heated handlebars would be something someone clever could come up with.

Electric tape isn't much of a thermal insulator. Bar tape ought to do nicely, however.

Hmmm...what about something like PlastiDip for the levers? Once it dries, it should be pretty darn secure, but you could theoretically cut/peel it off later if you really wanted to.

Sugru!

OMG. I can't believe I forgot about Sugru.

Ooh, that stuff looks cool!

Someone, maybe it was one of you, was telling me about Sugru at the last BikePGH volunteer night. Cool stuff.

That's some neat stuff indeed!

Also Pseudacris, I used to have Lobster Claw gloves (I called them Ninja Turtle gloves, for obvious reasons), but I lost one of them.

"this is why we can never have nice things!"

Has the jail trail been attended to? I won't ride it until Sunday, so I have my fingers crossed.

@pseudacris

You're welcome!

beechwood bike lanes are mostly clear now.

on the (untouched) trail past the high school, i almost had my first ever experience of getting stuck on my bike.

the only part of that that got any plowing was the initial "ramp" going up the hill (towards the parking lot adjacent from beechwood). so, of course someone parked their car there (to go along with the car someone parked ON the bike lane along penn). i had to straddle-walk my bike past the car, and i forgot to downshift, so when i got back on the bike (still going uphill, in 5-6" of snow) i could not really make it go no matter how hard i pushed on the pedals. i eventually got going and managed to downshift to a useable gear, but not after almost falling over several times... i'm sure it was pretty comical.

otherwise, that little section has been a lot of fun all week, it's very challenging to ride in that much snow. i've managed not to wipe out but have been very close. the number of tire tracks i see going through there keeps diminishing, by the end of the week i think it was just me and maybe one other person, unless people are riding over the shoe tracks (which seems even more difficult than just riding through the snow).

maybe i'm just easily amused...

@ helen You're good on the Jail Trail as of noon Saturday.

Both Jail Trail & Panther Hollow have been plowed as far as the plow could go (sort of).

On the downtown end of the Jail trail, the plowing stops as soon as the jail parking lot starts, so cut through it to 2nd Avenue.

On the south end of Panther Hollow, the plowing doesn't start til the top of the parking lot. The Path under the bridge leading up the the trail is a mess.

Careful out there, everything that isn't freshly salted is coated in a nice thick layer of glare ice. Greenfield hills are impassable by car, bike, and foot. I had to walk in people's yards through the snow.

The Eliza Furnace Trail was too icy for me so I ended up on Second Ave. With the sun up now the icy glaze should clear up swiftly.

I took rack n roll in. Hoping for a good ride home. E End and Peebles were rather like untouched creme brulee this morning.

The roads are just fine as long as you don't have to slow down or change direction.

Or change elevation.

Saw some guy riding downtown this morning on a dark Trek. I was impressed, until I realized that he was not wearing a helmet. While I can understand that some people may choose to ride without a helmet as a general practice, on a day like today it just seems foolish.

icecycle, lawrenceville

saddle detail:

be careful out there!

geez, when i left my house fair oaks was basically completely ice. i started walking my bike, but both sidewalks were ice too. i had turned around to go home, but i took one last look over my shoulder and saw another cyclist on Negley, headed for the hill.

so, then the dumb part of my brain kicked in and thought "well, if that guy thinks it's ok..." well, it was ok, but i still feel really dumb for doing it. i was riding both brakes and had my left foot down too, hoping for no ice... add in all the cars (some of which just *had* to pass me to get up to that slow moving line of cars ahead of me, of course), and it was pretty damn unsettling.

the streets in shadyside seemed much better than fair oaks... and it is above freezing so hopefully the ice won't last.

Reynold's St. was basically a skating rink this morning when I was on it. Someone had put chairs up to block the steep hill near Point Breeze where I had to walk in the snow between the street and sidewalk. Otherwise I would have been commuting on my ass-cheeks. The only place I saw evidence of road salt was the parking lot in Mellon Park.

Any time I applied the brakes my wheels grew minds of their own and wanted to go in every direction except straight ahead.

At one intersection I slid out, put my foot down and continued sliding on my foot + 2 wheels.

It was a pain in the arse (literally) to get to work today, but I'm still glad I didn't take the car.

The worst part of my commute this morning was taking my bike down the stairs and across the sidewalk. Both were sheets of ice, but the streets (Fairmount - Negley - Ellsworth - Fifth) were pretty well-salted and clear. The small sections where I encountered ice were handled fairly well by my studded tires.

Nice pic Erok!

Studs handled my commute fine, Mix of Mclure/Beaver ave and north shore trail. I would not have wanted to do the trail part without the studs, but the roads werent too bad.

slopes were fine this morning, but my steps and the roads out in washington county were slippy. Got real bad at dawn.

i didn't head to work until mid-morning, so the streets were fine by then. but i stepped off my bike onto the brick part of the sidewalk on craig street, and very nearly bit it hard. i still had one foot clipped in and stepped with one foot on the curb, where there was absolutely no traction, so i gracefully leaped from the bike and caught myself after flailing around (also very graceful, like an adagio dancer, i have no doubt) for a moment. good times!

I worked really late last night, and everything was already frozen when wanted to go home. I figure my studded tires would have been fine, but all the idiots in cars would probably side and hit me, so I just left my bike there last night.

This morning, waiting for the bus at the top of Winterburn and Farnsworth in Greenfield. I watched as cars blew up or down Winterburn (which was heavily salted) and then rapidly turn down Farnsworth, which had zero salt, and is one of those super narrow tertiary 2-way streets with parked cars on both sides, but only room for barely one car to pass between them. It also has a 30% grade, at least - closer to 40% at the very top.

These cars (and one big truck) started to fish tail, but since it was so narrow, they just hit the parked cars, continued to slide, bounce to the other side, hit the other parked cars. They all slid down this hill, hitting every single parked car all the way down. What a mess

... and how many of them just took off without identifying themselves to the owners of said parked cars? !#$#^%$#@ scofflaw cyclists.

Most of the people who had cars parked there walked outside every time someone hit their car. I bet they had a stack of insurance information by the end of the the morning. That will be a headache and a half to deal with a dozen different insurance companies for all the people who hit your car.

please tell us you have video

Unfortunately, no. You can go tour the damage on Farnsworth though

I was using my phone to wait on hold with PAT to see if my bus is detoured, or I would have grabbed video.

You know, instead of going back inside their homes after their cars were sideswiped and then coming back out when it happened again, a smart resident would have gone to the top of the hill and stopped people from trying to get down the hill in the first place.

Except you couldn't really walk up the hill, and to their credit, they were yelling and hollering at the cars -- and I was waving. There were 3 that did this while I was waiting at the bus stop and all of them went around the corner too fast to notice anyone standing there yelling and waving. And once they turned, there really wasn't any going back, they immediately started to slide.

I like the idea of blocking it with some chairs or something, but I doubt I could have carried chairs up the hill.

slipped and fell down the stairs of my building while carrying my bike, which landed on top of me. bruised up my leg real good.

ouch RF... I hope you're ok.

Anyone see how that Panther Hollow is doing tonight? I might be going through there in the next half hour...but will take the 5th bus lane to Craft if it's hazardous....

Panther Hollow: easy going, just was through there. You should still enter the trail at the top of the parking lot, but once you're on it, it's nice n melted. Just puddles on the wide part.

Same with Jail Trail.

At this typing (6:20 p.m.) it's still well above freezing, and per National Weather Service isn't supposed to hit freezing until about 11 p.m.

The puddles might freeze hard overnight, but there seemed to be plenty of room around them.

It's not supposed to be above freezing again for 2 weeks so hopefully there's not too much ice!

Kdka has a video of cars going way out of control In beechview. I assume they are on this page (no flash player on iPad)

http://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2011/01/18/icy-conditions-cause-many-accidents-across-area/

ugh, i was looking forward to a nice warm ride home, i thought i'd ride around and find a nice place for the tag...

i didn't realize it was raining plus my pictures came out all crappy.

@salty: good luck tomorrow. The temp drops below freezing around midnight and keeps dropping throughout the day... One thing about winter, it really puts a premium on setting the next tag as soon as possible.

Here's something cool: we live on top of a hill and our street seems to cross some atmospheric boundary. For example, I've come home in the night and the lower half of the hill was wet, the upper part was snow, with a sharp line between the two. This morning the bit in front of our house was ice, but one house down it was wet. It somehow reminds me of something I saw as a child: a rainstorm rushing towards me across a lake, with this sharp line between calm and bubbling water. Concrete abstractions.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to warm weather; the tags should get more interesting (or, at least, further afield).

i was at the hoover dam a couple months ago - we were just passing through but we stopped to look. i saw rain coming up the valley but when it got to where i was standing on the dam, it couldn't quite get across that threshold. the raindrops were blowing towards me and then kind of getting deflected at the last moment - it looked like magic or a movie special effect or something. i was mesmerized; it stayed that way for maybe 30 seconds before it made it over and i had to run for cover.

anyways, hopefully it's not too ugly tomorrow am... but i'll set a tag even if it's in front of my house

stefb that video is insane. that second car was flying!

Yea, I think they got their brake and gas mixed up or something.

i like how people were blaming the city for this as if they were surprised it was icy when they drove on that hill.

I'm sure they're not the same sort of people who have ever railed against "big government" and the "nanny state."

i kinda felt bad for public works director Kaz on that video. kdka seemed to try to get him in a "gotcha" moment, when really, he's right, everyone knew how bad the roads were. i wonder if the trucks could've even gotten down that hill without destroying every car in it's path

The P-G reported that six city salt trucks were involved in ice-related crashes on Tuesday. Perhaps if they had tried to salt Fallowfield, there would have been seven.

Maybe we need technology that can salt a road without driving a truck down it. How about a salt cannon? Or a fleet of RC toy helicopters toting thimbles of salt?

How about, if it's all icy like that, stay the hell off that street? Really, I'm amazed at drivers who think they can drive up/down some slope that they cannot even stand on.

I've always wondered if it would be possible to ice skate downhill. Apparently another opportunity for testing has come and gone. Probably for the best.

no way, you should definitely do that and report back to us for our entertainment

@edmonds - Definitely possible.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7LNI9Oycso

ice skate downhill

Been there. Done that. Survived.

i wonder how you would get down or even around beechview if it were icy. in this instance, it appears waiting would be advisable, since the ice didn't last all that long, but otherwise, are there any streets over there that are less than like 10%?

paging mr sloaps.

when i lived up 'ere, there were boxes on the street that were filled with salt. of course on an extreme day like that, a small amount of salt is like pissing in the ocean

That's fantastic, I thought it could be done. Now I feel like I lack the motivation to follow through on my ideas.

yeah, salt boxes... I'm gonna be selfish on this one and say the slopes were fine, considering last year when my neighbor decided to take Monastery on a saturday morning. Almost landed on Welsh, but certainly did land on the front page of the Sunday edition.

Perhaps we could hire people on these problem streets to throw salt down and maybe give them a traffic control barrel or two, if the road is too icy, they put up the barrels. Kind of pay them like we do crossing guards?

"no way, you should definitely do that and report back to us for our entertainment "

And film it.

+100 - SALT CANNON!!

Have no idea what that would look like, or how it would work, but sounds awesome!

btw, I just took a nice little roll on the asphalt while walking out to get my mail. Wearing my Chrome shoes, no less. Watch it out there!

To the lady jogging up the liberty sidewalk/sheet of ice this evening: you're much braver than I am.

I was uneasy walking my bike up that sidewalk, slipping every now and again. Still a little sore from falling down the icy stairs yesterday, haha. Nothing broken, and barely bruised at this point, so I'll hopefully be fine tomorrow!

Ha ha...those drivers on Fallowfield made international news. One of my former colleagues in the Netherlands sent me this one: http://nos.nl/video/212591-glijpartij-in-pittsburgh.html

HAha! Does that seriously translate to "Sliding Party in Pittsburgh"?

nice night for a ride, aside from my glasses fogging up...

my friend in NYC sent me that beechview video. sigh.

AGH to morningside via allegheny trail, rr road, main st etna/sharpsburg to highland park bridge. Good ride. Nice and quiet.

That's awesome Colin!!

I got friendly "way to go" honks this morning from at least 3 cars. At least thats what I am interpreting it as. Was a mostly uneventful ride in and most of the drivers passing me we going out of their way to be cautious.

Santa!?

oh, it was ice that caused accidents, I thought maybe it was people driving thier vehicles, not really paying attention,

About the plows and salt in Pittsburgh. People have ridiculous expectations about snow removal. I grew up in Erie, the side streets have snow on them all winter until it melts. They plow, but a layer of snow is permanent. Here, if the snow and slush isn't completely gone during a snow storm the city isn't doing it's job.

oh, it was ice that caused accidents, I thought maybe it was people driving thier vehicles, not really paying attention,

i've been saying this about so-called "black ice" for a bit now. it bugs me that people have this free excuse for not maintaining control of their vehicle. what is this stuff, anyway? invisible? unlike other ice which is bright and shiny? if the ground is wet and it's below freezing, there may be ice on the ground, and just because you can't see it doesn't give you a free pass to slide all over it and break stuff.

anyway, black ice is a sham, and that rant felt nice.

Black ice means something else in Minnesota. It is when the road is so cold (below zero, F) that car exhaust freezes on contact with it, creating a nice, smooth layer of "black ice" at intersections where cars are sitting idle a lot. This is the language TV weatherman and everyone else uses. Nobody ever calls water freezing on the road "black ice" in the upper midwest, it is just ice, duh.

@dwillen, are you still glad you put on the studded tires?

almost fell when turning from penn onto 9th today when I hit a manhole cover. luckily, I caught myself, and at least I learned to take it slower around corners, heh.

also the thin snow layer on side streets is actually much more pleasant to drive on than the salted but not plowed slush crap that sits on the streets here. try riding your bike in the slushy shit and then move over to the clean snow out of the main driving lane. you'll see what i mean.

people in this city need to learn how to put snow tires on their cars in winter and drive in a manner that doesn't resemble a rectum.

@Pseudacris yes.. though I haven't been on my bike much this week, work kicking my butt.

@dwillen, I know the feeling, though I commuted in yesterday and just stayed the night at work, because it was late and I didn't feel like venturing back outside, just to come back within the next 12 hours...

@rsprake +1000000 - god do i hate listening to people whine about snow removal...

Forbes bike lanes outbound east of Sq Hill kinda stink right now. If you're *highly visible and fine w/ taking the lane through the cemetery & park area, it's fine. The bike lane is pure flakyslush.

Today was a really good day. I was worried when I saw that it was below 10 degrees when I left the house (at 4am, no less...). I just wore my usual sweatpants/jeans, one pair of socks, falling-apart shoes, long sleeve/tshirt/thin hoodie/heavy hoodie with my cheap gloves.

I couldn't find my winter hat, so I loosened the chin strap on my helmet and wore both of my hood up underneath, and wrapped a scarf around my face. I don't doubt for a second that I looked absurd, haha.

The way home was unusually calm, so that was nice. I think most people didn't want to leave their house because it was so cold. I decided to take sassafras (at least I think i did. I went through a whole bunch of parking lots before spilling back out onto liberty, heh), and it was pretty nice.

Days like today remind me why I like winter.

just being outside and walking from my house to car or car into a building doesn't feel as cold as riding a bike in 15 degree weather. i have not experienced the 0 degree weather just yet, but i may at some point this weekend.

I really wish I had the money to bus to work today. I'm sure I've ridden in worse though.

looks like we've got some snow again. i've never really ridden the trails in the snow, and i'm thinking of heading from cmu to the south side for the dd show at otb. what kind of ride should i expect?

The jail trail and hot metal were fairly clear this morning. Not sure what it will be like tonight. Looking out my office window, there is snow on the road (not sure how much).

@hidden. My best guess would be that you're fine on the way there, but who knows about the way back. This morning, everything was fine except for the ramps. You could bike over and then take the 75 bus back. That's one of the routes that's always supposed to have a rack on it. Goes from S Side Works to Bakery Square via Ellsworth.

I was dressed for the weather when I left the house, but the temp dropped a bit while I was working so I scraped together some bus fare only to wait about 45 minutes for a bus with a rack, which then broke down halfway there. But on the bright side, there was a different bus right behind it that I was able to take.

All in all, that was actually pretty funny.

This morning (thursday, 1/27) panther Hollow and Jail trails had a light layer of snow over what may have been a bit slippery, but not problematic. It was interesting last night to ride home on a clear (well, maybe a light layer of slush) trail and find a layer of snow on my driveway. Just a bit farther east (and elevation?) made a difference.

quick question...has anyone been out yet? It doesn't look all that bad, but I'm thinking of bussing it. Rather not though, it's surprisingly warm.

The Wilkinsburg/East Liberty/Shadyside area is just wet. There were a couple of little spots of ice where the surfaces have never been salted. The news must have sufficiently freaked everyone out because the roads are pretty calm and traffic is sparse right now.

When I took the dog out at 6 am I kind of wished I had a helmet on. Walking. But I'm a way out of town, and that was a while ago, so that may not be indicative for you.

yeah, liberty inbound looks okay, I'm kind of worried about downtown, ha.

I had the experience of driving to the mechanic and busing back home. I'd seen the salt truck go down my street and up Perrymont, so I knew they were OK. Drove there no problem. The surprise was in walking back down Perrymont in the driving lane and finding my footing very squirrely. So, even where it's been salted and seems to be OK to drive on, no it isn't, really.

Not to jinx the situation, but what happened to the giant ice storm we were promised?

I'm glad I rode in today despite the forecast, sheesh.

Rode to work, and it was fun, and a really nice day! I bussed it home though, I'm a wimp when it comes to rain+cold.

Was out and about at 7 AM today (in my truck, sorry), when the weather was particularly nasty- wind swirling, pretty steady snow, deepening cold, and road conditions nearly-completely f*&%ed.

Heading up Forbes from South Braddock, some hearty viking was chugging up the hill, and I thought: "badass!"

I must have seen three of four others within the next 30 minutes.

Here's to you guys/gals. Rule 9 applies, with extra credit!

Today was the first ride in where I thought, "Wow, my eyeballs are actually cold." The rest of me was ok though. Heading out back into it soon for the ride home.

Sorry about this snow guys. I took my studded tires off yesterday and gave my bike a thorough cleaning for the first time since I bought it.

Apparently biking around in a t-shirt last week did strange things with my head. Thinking of bussing it home just so I don't mess up my nice clean drivetrain.

I had a mid-afternoon lunch at Ross Park Mall, and was amazed to see a cyclist climbing the main road up into the mall at about 4:30. The snow was getting pretty serious by that point. He had to be really BA to begin with, climbing that hill, snow or not.

I saw four or five commuters this morning along north shore drive. Most had no fenders.

felt like the last bits of freezing rain were cutting my face on the way home. anyway, the reward for being out today was definitely coming home and changing into sweats and a hoodie

1hr to get from the strip to s'liberty starting at 6:30 pm tonight on road bike slicks. Managed to climb Liberty Ave to Bloomfield, then walked the rest of the way. Cleats, brakes, everything iced up. A bit sketchy out there.

You are a badass. I nearly rode in today, thinking the snow ws supposed to hit overnight (after 10pm). I barely made it up liberty in my little Honda fit.

Ugh, I was gonna go do some laps out at the Highland Park track tomorrow morning before work. Looks like that idea is canned.

Tomorrow is a good day for a mtb or skis.

@stefb... I did feel pretty badassed when I wasn't walking

My bus got stuck on Blvd of the Allies after stopping at an uphill stoplight.. Stuck stuck. He asked people to move to the back so he could have more traction. I am glad I didn't ride home. Pretty sure studs wouldn't have been any help anyway.

the city pulled another car back onto brosville.

I'd like to bike today, but noblestown and poplar aren't plowed well enough in some areas to "share the road" and the sidewalks are narrow and treacherous after the first refreeze. and some of the fast food joints like to plow their snow onto the sidewalk. classy.

anyone know if the main roads downtown/surrounding are really icy?

Definitely salting my stairs before carrying my bike down them this time, regardless.

I rode in on Penn and a lot of it is that sort of packed down snow with a bit of slush to it. I was very slippery to walk on, but my mildly knobby tires did okay. Once you're downtown, it gets a little rougher because the ice/slush starts to break up and the surface gets really bumpy.

My rear MTB tire blew out a couple of days ago, so I had a slick on...

Had to walk up one hill in West Mifflin. The power was out around the West Mifflin PAT garage and the county airport.

Was called a "dumbass" followed 20 seconds later by "asshole" from opposing traffic.

The electric guys in cherry pickers were cooler though "There's a guy on a bike!" one of they said in a bemused voice.

Not bad once I hit second ave

Good times today. Put studded tires on my new cyclocross bike for the first time...

but I also broke my streak of no falls at all this winter. Turning into the rite-aid parking lot in wilkinsburg while downshifting, my rear wheel washed out, and just when I went to put that extra power into the pedals I realized the RD hadn't fully shifted yet... so I fell on my butt at a near complete stop. Must've been goofy looking.

Hats off to the person in bright yellow who rode by my bus stop on freeport this morning. He or she made it look effortless, while motorists were sliding about. very inspiring, and shoots holes through my "reasons" for putting off commuting by 2 wheels till spring.

some of the fast food joints like to plow their snow onto the sidewalk. classy.

We need to start complaining to the city about stuff like this. If you are paying someone to clear your property, you can pay them the extra fraction to do it legally.

The city law is that they have 24 hours after it stops snowing to clear the sidewalk. The procedure is that they won't take action unless there's a complaint so, after 24 hours, call 311. They will dispatch someone to look at the situation and they will issue a warning. The clock starts from then and if they don't clear the sidewalk 24 hours after that and citation will be issued. I believe the fine is $25.

So, with all that it will probably take 3 days start to finish.

And before you disparage the $25 fine as being too low, I heard from a city councilman that if the fine were higher then the city employee would be less likely to actually issue the fine. Better to have it low than to never have a fine accessed at all.

Eh, it probably cost $25 just to receive the complaint and send the person out to look at the sidewalk. But I guess it encourages people to plow faster.

I shoveled last night, but then the city plowed the snow back on the sidewalk.

There's the fine and then there's the costs, so the actual price would be higher.

I've heard that it's all well and good if you report a neighbor for not shoveling, but the inspector will check the whole block and may issue additional tickets. You might want to weigh reporting against maintaining peaceful neighbor relations. (That said, I believe that businesses have the responsibility to not mess up public spaces, and should be tagged.)

So, with all that it will probably take 3 days start to finish.

Still, I've seen plenty of sidewalks that don't get cleared for weeks. But sit at a parking meter for 5 minutes past its expiration and you can get a $30 ticket. The law does not require a 24 warning period -- that's just the enforcement wing deciding that this is a law they don't care much about.

Some other cities have a program that works like this:

you have N hours to clear your walk after a snowstorm. If it's not cleared, a city subcontractor will clear it for you and send you the bill (something like $40 + $1/ft). People bid for the city contract, much like tow companies do. Unemployed adults and teens go door to door offering to undercut the city. People get work, and the sidewalks get cleared.

When did it officially stop snowing? I'll set a timer...

"(That said, I believe that businesses have the responsibility to not mess up public spaces, and should be tagged.)"

In most municipalities, the sidewalks are part of the public right-of-way, and therefore property of the municipality, aka Public Property. However, snow removal and maintenance are the responsibility of the property owner, whether it is a residence, apartment or business. Kind of a gotcha set-up, but that's usually how it goes.

"The law does not require a 24 warning period"

Not always true. This may vary by municipality, but in many, the clock doesn't start ticking for 24 hours. Snow removal ordinances are intended to encourage property owners to do what they should do anyway. The 24 hour "grace period" is, I think, a reasonable interval for owners to react to the snow and shovel. Consider a storm like last night - caught a lot of people by surprise. Homeowner wakes up this morning, has to get to work, but doesn't have time to shovel. Goes to work today, comes home, shovels after dinner.

And I'm not sure the parking meter violation is a reasonable comparison. Parking meters generally are located in business districts, and are intended to keep people from just stashing their car in a convenient place, preventing business patrons from parking there to shop, etc.. So the meter is intended to keep the cars coming and going, and so the enforcement necessarily should be more timely.

@quizbot Managed to climb Liberty Ave to Bloomfield, then walked the rest of the way.

Thanks for this report.

If you hadn't written I would have ridden home last night -and it would have been in no way safe.

ALMKLM: The 24-hour warning period I was referring to is the one that starts 24 hours after the snow stops. Kordite said that 24 hours after the snow stops (when a violation has technically already occurred) a warning will be issued with 24 hours given for compliance. It's that latter 24-hour grace that I don't believe is written into the law. Nor the announced policy that "we won't bother to enforce this unless someone really wants to risk pissing off their neighbors by complaining" (as opposed to pissing off their neighbors by not shoveling).

Lyle: Law as written vs. Law as enforced are almost always two different things, I think we agree on that.

The 03:51 report from the National Weather Service is the last one to observe falling snow, so add an hour for good measure, so say 05:00 2/22/2011 to start the timer.

In most municipalities, the sidewalks are part of the public right-of-way, and therefore property of the municipality, aka Public Property.

As I understand it, sidewalks being part of the public right-of-way doesn't make them the property of the municipality. Sidewalks are still the property of the individual landowner. He's obliged to grant access to everyone on that part of his property and to keep it clear, but that's a different thing from not owning it.

Steven: Municipal rights of way generally include the area from sidewalk to sidewalk - including the sidewalks themselves. Although owned by the municipality, they are the responsibility of the landowner. The "right of way" is granted by the municipality, as differentiated from private property - like a yard you could put a fence around.

Example: if you own a cafe and want outdoor seating, but your building abuts the sidewalk, you do not have the right to simply put tables out. You need either a permit or license agreement with the municipality because you are using the public "right of way" for private purposes.

tried to ride down liberty, slid and fell, walked to mancini's in the strip and caught a ride to market square. bussed home because I'm a wimp, haha.

Mad props to the two people who passed me on bikes as I was walking, (one on a mountain bike, one on smooth road bike tires). Rule #9, I believe.

Thanks for the correction, ALMKLM!

Speaking of snow, what are the jail trail and junction hollow like today?

@ALMKLM and Steven -- I'll put on my attorney's hat here .

In PA if the street is opened, public or private, the landowner normally owns to the center of the street unless his deed says otherwise (such as if his deed says he owns only to the edge of the right-of-way). If the street is unopened, he normally owns just to the edge of the right-of-way. But as soon as the street is opened, his ownership then automatically by law extends to the center of the street.

However, in the case of the opened street even though the landowner may own to the middle of it, the public right-of-way gives the public a superior right to use the right-of-way space for passage. The landowner can still make his own use of the public right-of-way space so long as it doesn't unreasonably interfere with the public's superior right to use the same space for passage.

Hence it becomes the landowners responsibility to keep the sidewalk clean for the public's benefit as he owns the land where the sidewalk sits. But in your example of the outdoor tables, since this could interefere unreasonably with the public's superior right of passage, he needs to get the municipality's OK to do it.

Off the top of my head, I think the reason the landowner has the responsilibity to do the sidewalk for the benefit of the public, but the municpality has the responsibility for the half of the street to its center that the landowner owns is simply administrative convenience.

Thanks cdavey, and apologies, Steven.

It sounds like we were each kinda right: in my case the position as I understand it is the defacto "ownership", or as cdavey describes it, as the "public's superior right of passage."

The times i've encountered this have each been confusing, but your description is about as clear as i've heard.

Thanks cdavey and ALMKLM. Great explanation.

We now return you to your regular snow discussion.

the roads were surprisingly clear today, even the bike lanes aren't that bad! Whether it was the city or the warmth melting all the snow, I'm glad it happened!

sooo, about the snow in Panther Hollow? I'm about ready to attempt a trip back to the East End and wondering if I should probably expect a nice long climb up Greenfield instead?

You should climb Greenfield anyway, because hills are good for you.

I don't know, but I left work AND it's still light. Wooyah! I feel like a newborn mushroom.

Panther hollow is clear. I was just there. Jail trail not so much. It is passable but I slid around a lot on my slicks until i just went into the snow that hadn't been ridden through yet.

haha edmonds59

dwillen, I haven't ridden in 3+ weeks, I think I need to work my way back up to that.

Thanks Stef!

Have you tried going back through Oakland, whence you came? I've been going across the Birmingham Bridge, then cruising up the sidewalk on Fifth, then cutting down to Forbes at Craft. The sidewalk is a little crusty at the moment, but I suspect it'll be clear by the end of the day.

@dwillen and @gimp: do you take the sidewalk or shoulder when climbing Greenfield? I usually only go down it but am feeling "up" to adding to my repertoire of climbs. I can't recall if there is a sidewalk, but the shoulder appears narrower on the uphill(outbound) side.

I always take the road going up Greenfield, though I have seen people on the sidewalk, too. That said, I usually avoid Greenfield on weekdays or around rush hour. My personal cutoff time used to be 6 pm or so (i.e., traffic seemed calmer after that point), but it seems like in the last few years, more commuters have been coming down Second Ave and up Greenfield to shortcut the Parkway. There's a woman in my downtown office who has told me she does this, for example.

When I climb Greenfield, I do the sidewalk which is on the opposite side of the street. Normally, I wouldn't do that but the sidewalk is very wide if not particularly well maintained.

Also, in the winter months, it rarely seems to be shoveled with any consistency. So, I've been doing Panther Hallow lately.

+1 on avoiding on weekdays and during rush hours. Actually, if I'm doing the climb on the weekend/early in the day then I don't use the sidewalk... it's just the rush hour traffic combined w/ my slowness that concerns me up that hill.

I climb Hazelwood instead of Greenfield Ave. The traffic is lighter, the road is wider, with better sight lines and no stop signs. Getting to it is a bit of a challenge, especially right on the cusp of the rush hour when the traffic hasn't yet got completely congested.

In the winter I take the road going up. Nobody takes care of their sidewalk so shoveling is non-existent. The sidewalk is in pretty rough shape to begin with.

In the summer, it varies. I'll do both. People often park on the sidewalk though.

I recently added a mirror to my helmet, which makes me feel better about biking on the road up the hill.

Hazelwood would add a bit of an extra climb for me.

Climbing Greenfield, I usually take teh road, except for sometimes the block or two between McCaslin and Frank.

When I'm trying to train, I do a circle that goes from 2nd Ave -> Greenfield ->Loretta-> Murray-> Beacon ->Mulhatton -> Shady-> Wilkins- Beeler-> Forbes -> Maggie Morrison -> Schenley Dr-> Blvd Allies-> Bates. One lap is less than 7 miles, but it's an OK workout.

I've never done Greenfield at rush hour.

I take the road, the sidewalk seems to be too unreliable. I look over my shoulder A LOT. I tend to leave work too late to worry about rush hour.

Anyone been on Eliza Furnace/Jail Trail this week? It hadn't been touched aside from the bit by PNC on Wednesday morning, and sometime during the day they did a wee little bit more towards the parking lot. I 311'ed it yesterday, and got a "we informed the correct people, please be patient" response this afternoon.

I'm heading downtown early tomorrow and trying to decide if I should bike (and play the new tag game!) or just take the bus.

It's clear, see above.

"It is passable but I slid around a lot on my slicks until i just went into the snow that hadn't been ridden through yet."

I imagine that nice unridden snow will all be ice by tomorrow. Or am I missing another post?

Jail trail is in decent shape. I took it home tonight around 7. There was the occasional slushy spot but 90-95% was clear - I was pleasantly surprised. Based on the forecast it looks like it's going to stay above freezing till tomorrow afternoon/evening.

To the pink bike on Negley just now- between the weather and the traffic, pretty badass!

(And, great visibility with lights and coat! Also, way to take the lane!)

Bring back the snow, last night was miserable. When it was a light rain around 7 it wasn't too bad aside from forcing me to stop and clean my glasses periodically. By midnight - well, I didn't turn down a ride home in a car.

WFH today which is nice (for me, anyways) because it looks like more of the same. ugh.

I would like to see spring.

Sorry I never posted about my ride. I didn't see the rest of the jail trail, but the section from HMB to the Greenfield trailhead was all clear. The bridge was a little sketchy on Wednesday night, but Thursday night some clear paths have been made.

I actually didn't mind the rain this morning. I kinda like riding in it, as long as I am prepared for it.

You're a trooper bjanaszek! Though I prefer warmer rain or snow. This cold rain just sort of hangs in the air.

I was comfortable in the rain last night (rain jacket+hood+rain pants).. the icey snow at around 10:30am this morning was miserable on the face.

a fellow rider + coworker thinks that the temperature range 30-40 should be eliminated. "nothing good happens in that temperature range" he loves the snow, but not that wet quasi-ice crap. right now i sort of agree...

i've been trying to get him to give ride reports here, since he usually rides Greenfield - Eliza Furnace - downtown on the early side (6:30). even if i convince him, knowing him he'll post one report before it's spring then completely forget next year...heh

this morning was awesome, despite arriving to work soaked. Afternoon would've been better without the wind, but still not terrible. then again, I rode the bus more than the bike this afternoon.

Totally agree with the 30-40 degree temp range. I pussed out on riding on Thursday because i hate cold rain.