BIKEPGH MESSAGE BOARD ARCHIVE

It definitely made me sad once I got there to not have my big camera with me... but here's what I got.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/edr1084/sets/72157618289449542/

wow! 500 for real? i was guessing 300-ish. tons of fun!! i'm kind of surprised the police didn't kill my buzz. i wish i had my camera...

yeah, def around 500. there was a sign in sheet.

i love seeing shots of this. everyone looks so damn happy in them

about five minutes in, whoever was next to me said he was already sure it was the best thing he'd do in may.

i think i had a lot more fun than last year. this time, i just took it all in, tried to catch glimpses of how long the pack was (too long to tell), check out all the different sorts of bikes and bikers that came out, and be super happy that so many people came out to do something i love doing.

yeah, i was smiling the whole time, too.

oh, and free beer!

Dear Pedal Pittsburgh Riders,

You are allowed to ride a bicycle without lycra. You don't have to dress like a post-apocalyptic ballerina to ride.

Curmudgeonly yours,

Mick

that was another awesome ride! thanks for sharing scott!

You are allowed to ride a bicycle without lycra. You don't have to dress like a post-apocalyptic ballerina to ride.

I dunno...I kinda like getting lycraed up once in while. Makes me feel kinda funny, like when we climbed the rope in gym class.

--Dan "Wears lycra, wool, sandals, street shoes, and SPDs, more or less interchangeably or in aggregate based on temperature and mood. AND reserves curmudgeonliness for real offenses like squeaky chains and badly-trimmed shifters..."

I had SO much fun! Such a beautiful evening, too. Aside from the bit where we got to stop and drink beer, my favorite part was when a disgruntled car driver (who was actually driving in the opposite direction anyway, and therefore unimpeded by the bicycle stampede) yelled out of his window in an angry fashion "use the bike lane!". "We ARE the bike lane" someone yelled in response. Rad!! Oh yeah, and the purple octopus was awesome. I'm going to wear a costume next year, too.

Mick,

do you really think there will be ballerinas after

the apocalypse? really?

i wrote a really long thing about how disgusted i was by the lack of respect that i saw by many cyclists on this ride, but i decided to delete most of it.

but really. there's two lanes and one's a dedicated bike lane. is it really so hard to not completely block traffic on a heavily traveled road and then antagonize people when they suggest that they use the lane as it was intended? not saying there weren't any drivers that were being dicks, but i saw plenty of cyclists that were being dicks as well.

one of the reasons why i've given up on critical mass and why i'll find out where the keg ride ends next year and show up without creating more angry drivers.

I was really hoping Steve was about to say he had a "really long thing" about post-apocalyptic ballerinas.

It's awesome that 500ish people will show up to something on bikes. (or is it 500ish people will show up for free beer?) That's like as many people that do the MS150, race at the oval, ride the PORC rides, and critical mass combined.

p.s. I wear lycra underneath my dress clothes at work. It makes me feel really aero while sitting at my desk.

a heavily traveled road

ha. me and brad rode ahead to get pictures of people on elb, and we were laughing that there were absolutely no cars on it in either direction. we could see all the way to negley. maybe one car.

The MS150 draws a few thousand riders...

And yeah, no traffic at all on E Liberty Blvd. And the passing of the cyclists took no longer than a funeral procession. No apologies from this guy.

Ummm. I'm kinda with Steve here?

I think it is awesome, wonderful, terrific that so many people are showing up on bikes. I'm ecstatic. Five years ago I would not have believed it. Not sure I believe it now!

I think it means we are winning.

But if we ride in groups the way we do now we won't win. I think people ride badly in groups; we don't obey traffic laws; we block traffic. We don't "share the road", you know?

It comes from two or three places. First, from critical mass -- CM is built on the idea that cyclists need to dominate the road in order to be safe, and that by showing off once a month, we make a Statement. Well there are plenty of opinions about it, I think I'll agree that it is fine as an occasional Statement. But I've always felt that the critical mass is one. One cyclist.

Second, from competitive group rides, training rides, what have you. Here the feeling is that you are competing with other riders in the group, don't want to get dropped, don't want to be the nerd, besides it's just one bicycle running the red light and we're marginal outcasts who get no respect anyway so who cares?

Well, do we want to be marginalized outcasts? Not me.

Third, from scheduled events, from Pedal Pittsburgh, MS 150 and the like. These are the casual once-a-month cyclists. We can't get our road rules here.

Brad, you got the right analogy, that's the one I thought of too. The only time that cars drive on the road the way we did is in a funeral procession. Think about it.

I want ten thousand cyclists on the streets every day, so I think it's gotta be done different. What we do now doesn't scale.

i think in that particular circumstance, the most efficient way to transport 500 people on bicycles is 250 people per lane. 250 people using one lane is, i would think in most people's minds, a valid use of a public roadway over one or two people that happen to be driving a car on the same road.

i've also seen group motorcycle rides that act lke critical mass. it's just they look tougher. maybe that's a better analogy.

i also agree mostly, and don't think there is one best way to advocate.

I told everyone I knew - even out of towners - about the keg ride, but I didn't attend because I forgot. lol.

for next year: could the kegs be transported by tandems? could that speed the commute, or was the speed not an issue? if so, then I know of a semi-abandoned tandem left outside Bar 11 on the southside...

Steevo,

I certainly hope there will be ballerinas after the apocalypse. They will, unfortunately, be mutants and most likely look like television watchers in lycra with 5 o'clock shadow.

But I'll take what I can get

The reality is, I usually associate the innocent (albeit extremely unappealling to me) habit of wearing lycra with folks that pass too close with no warning. Usually it's not that they want to get anywhere faster, it's just they seem to be unable to bike without the racing mentality: "must pass. must be the winner. must pass."

It's unsafe and goes against my image of bicycling - a good way to get from point A to point B.

As Dan quite rightly pointed out, I should have reserved my curmudgeoninity for the more suitable subject of behavior, though, and not for the innocent lycra.

As to the subject of mass rides, I rode critical mass once. I felt that it wouldn't do anything except piss drivers off (which is ok, I guess) and equally piss off drivers who are considerate, thoughtful folks who are trying to get somewhere as well as piss off the jerks.

CM felt like a bunch of bicyclists acting like (ugh!) the worst drivers.

I'm fairly considerate of drivers, but I tend to scoff the law a bit when I get around. When I think it's a choice between safe and legal, I'll always take safe. Always. Quick vs legal? Well... I dunno.

Of course, orderly traffic can't depend of each person assessing the safety of each intersection and every situation. One or two riders going up the bus lane is cool. 50 or 60 is probably not.

I'm guessing that if bicycling becomes standard (and, after all, we will run out of oil), the laws will have to change to reflect a different traffic mentality.

Mick

Personally, I love the spectacle we created. It's like gorilla marketing for people having fun on bikes. The few people in cars that got pissed, which weren't many, were pissed because they were stuck in their cars... not having fun. I just don't think that we made that many new enemies last Friday.

Guerilla.

Gorilla marketing would be ever more threatening.

ha! thanks editor

I posted photos from this year's ride as well:

http://randomprecisionphoto.com/?p=524

Gorillas. Funny. I've always liked the word cagers. I think it has the right feel for the sad primates confined in boxes. I don't like to annoy them, but I don't mind making them envious.

To hell with the law.

Yeah I am in the habit of associating mexicans with stabbing my friends in the chest, gays with soliciting sex in bathrooms in parks, blacks with shooting my neighbors, and women with breaking my heart....

because those are what my life experiences have led me to believe. Or maybe it is different to judge somebody on their clothing...



he reality is, I usually associate the innocent (albeit extremely unappealling to me) habit of wearing lycra with folks that pass too close with no warning. Usually it's not that they want to get anywhere faster, it's just they seem to be unable to bike without the racing mentality: "must pass. must be the winner. must pass."

BradQ, I almost ran you over on east liberty! You got me here, looks like I am having fun.

"Yeah I am in the habit of associating mexicans with stabbing my friends in the chest, gays with soliciting sex in bathrooms in parks, blacks with shooting my neighbors, and women with breaking my heart...."

Typically, none of those characteristics are associated with personal choice and I would be loath to judge.

Wearing lycra is choice. Passing without warning is a choice.

Mick

I'd suggest that equating the wearing of lycra with the habit of passing without warning is roughly equivalent to assuming that anyone riding a bicycle blows through red lights.

In both cases, there's plenty of evidence to confirm the belief, but it's still not necessarily correct.

Heck, it's as bad as saying that riding a 'bent leads to a luxurious beard, or that riding fixed means your knuckle tats are less than eloquent.

--Dan "Passed a jogger without warning today, while wearing street clothes"

dan- sorry man, i'll stop with the beard jokes. *hugs*

Don't stop, m'man. A day without gentle mockery is a day without sunshine...

Ballerinas, gorillas, and octopusses (octopie?) not withstanding, I had a great time this year too - much more fun than previous years. But I think that's because we're getting better at putting this thing together. There's no guidebook describing the necessary particulars of delivering kegs of beer by large mass of slow-moving bicycles, but we're definitely finding our way more and more each year as it continues to grow.

The basic dilemma is that there is no way of knowing how many people will show up until they actually arrive, and man... FIVE HUNDRED PEOPLE? Are you seriously kidding me??? That was just AWESOME - still is!

Sure, some things could have been better. In hindsight, I probably should have made mention at the start that this is a ride without any kind day pass on traffic laws. And as an especially SLOW and controlled ride (unlike CM), it's not a big deal to stop and wait out a red light, as you will be able to catch up with the slugs up front (especially me) pulling the kegs without too much trouble... but I think I was too stunned at the number of people that turned out to even think clearly.

But we did some early planning, and put over half the route on paths or bike lanes (seriously, where were all the cars on ELB that night?) so that dodged the issue a bit.

We'll likely make some more tweaks to the ride for next year and on, and maybe even reach out to the City for some traffic support to get that day-pass if that even makes sense. There's also a good chance this will turn into an event that will benefit some sort of charity.

But it will definitely be back next year, with a new batch and a new destination. And if by some miracle, the weather and the bikers of this city (and neighboring cities) double our numbers again as they have for the last 4 years, we'll find a way to handle all 1,000 of you. Count on that.

Thanks again everyone for coming out and supporting this event, and of course for supporting your local brewer here. Hope to see you at Growler Hours some time soon - always plenty of indoor bike parking!

Cheers,

Scott

Sorry folks, I've let myself rant a bit much here. (shrug) It happens.

Mick

it's not a big deal to stop and wait out a red light, as you will be able to catch up with the slugs up front

the problem is, that could actually make things more dangerous because there would be a mass of bikes, with cars peppered in between. i think the drivers who got inside of a huge mass would either stop and pull over, or get really really angry, as opposed to a little angry when they have to wait a couple of greens.

for what it's worth, every single driver i saw (and in fact, every single person i saw, be they driver, cyclist, pedestrian, or someone sitting outside a restaurant or house) smiled happily as we approached. there was a moment near the beginning where we took over both lanes of a two lane (one each way) street, and a woman who was coming against us in the lane that should've been free of cyclists, pulled over, rolled down her window, and laughingly cheered us on.

i didn't see the person who yelled "use the bike lane!", but based on what i saw, my initial reaction was "he must've been joking."

it's a very tricky task to move 500 cyclists through a busy city at any time of day, and i thought we all did a pretty excellent job for the task we put ourselves to. the only thing i could see making it better is the city getting involved. police marshals, road closings, whatever.

anyway, i had a blast. and anyone i saw that night had a blast. whether they were riding next to me, or bouncing their hydraulically charged, chopped-roof escalade up and down as we passed. and i can't wait until next year.

oh, and i also want to blame dan for something. he had a post somewhere (i can't seem to find it now) about squeaky chains. well, mine squealed today, and it was all his fault!

see, i had planned on lubricating just about everything today, and i went to my basement, which i share with two neighbors and the maintenance guy, and loaded my bike up for my ride. then i grabbed my bottle of lube from off the floor, where apparently one of my neighbors saw fit to knock it without returning it to its proper place. then i noticed that the nozzle-cap-thing was missing, and it was just a little tube sticking out the top. no worries, i said to myself, i'll just get to that when i get back.

and wouldn't you know it that blasted chain started squealing right around mile 30, and didn't give up the whole way. and if you hadn't said something about it, it never would've happened.

-dave "swears he's not superstitious"

Hmmm...is this from the same man whose drivetrain disintegrated half-way up Berryhill last year in the DD?

Something tells me there may be other factors at work here...

--Dan "jokes about flat tires, too"

here's my rant of the night...

i've felt that those bike lanes on east liberty are kind of an afterthought anyway. they connect the bustling area of the city where you can get a gun pulled on you by someone from a halfway house and the area of the city where the dude who pulled the gun fences your bike for more guns.

east liberty blvd is barely traveled by cars at most times of the day, and when there are cars, there is a 40% chance they are driving in the frickin bike lane anyway. i typically take the lanes there to avoid the geniuses who think they can pass a bike and then immediately swing a hard right with no signal.

500 people on bikes times 7 or 8 feet of space for each person? do the math. it's safer to travel in a group, not a LINE. i would still love to get a group this big (heck even 100) to actually try to get across the city together in a line so that everybody could see what a logistical nightmare it would be. it would have to be some semi-experienced cyclists so nobody gets freakin killed.

laws broken? fuck laws. if i'm doing something "wacky", it's (usually) because i have scientifically determined that it's the safest option. judges are more rational than police, and i can bike down to the courthouse during my work ever so easily to contest any such fuckery.

people in cars who get antagonized by a group of cyclists need to likely chill the fuck out. blaming the cyclists for the impatient homicidal maniacs out there is what is called "blaming the victim", and lacks some insight, IMO. yeah, half of the people there were taking their first ride of the season. some of them probably never rode on the streets of the city ever. some of them just suck at biking, but they all deserve to be safe on the streets and will still be there doing what they do even if you don't like it.

-r

wow, this thread has come full circle.

hiddenvariable- your description reminds me of one of those mentos commercials, where you can get away with anything, as long as you show them the mentos. only instead of candy we have beer

HiddenVariable, where were you in the pack?

unixd0rk, true. But the motorists also deserve some respect as well.

this is worth a look, from NYC,

http://bikingrules.org/rules/streetcode

found it from

http://www.streetsblog.org/2009/05/20/tas-biking-rules-campaign-takes-the-high-route/

I forget about pedestrians sometimes. I am super polite at the school crossings though.

rsprake: i respect motorists by deliberately placing myself in a position where they are forced to do the correct legal and safe thing when encountering a slow moving vehicle that appears to be blocking their way. other than that, all i can say is that there have to be exceptions for laws that do not consider that there will be 500+ cyclists on the street. considering that we managed to do this ride without anybody being physically harmed that i am aware of (except for when my chain snapped while leaving the bar and i mashed my knee against my headset), i would consider it a success.

i also agree completely with erok's statement that we were using the street in a way that moved more people in less space. if we had all been in cars, we would have likely jammed traffic for hours and had to miss out on the guy with the tricked out hydraulics at the light. ;]

The fundamental problem is that the law no longer reflects the reality of dozens or hundreds of cyclists getting together as a group fairly often, and as such should be changed. Exactly how, I don't know yet.

What would help is to collect some data. How long would it take to get 500 cars, or at least people in cars, past a single point? Even with police help? How 'bout if someone station themselves at the exit to a parking garage after some major athletic contest, and try to count noses and/or cars? Another good test would be to do likewise with the inbound Parkway East some morning.

My point is that even if we did hold up some cross traffic to get 500 people past, that that is a good thing, something to be encouraged in that it is the best, most efficient use of the street network. Re: Parkway East, even with a superhighway dedicated to moving large volumes of automobiles (note I said automobiles, not people), it cannot get 500 units past a point any better or faster than we did with a loose mass. McKnight or another car-specific suburban arterial would provide another data point.

Start collecting data, folks. It's hard to argue with facts.

"And the passing of the cyclists took no longer than a funeral procession."

Really? Comparing funeral procession traffic with a Friday night free beer ride? Remember this ride was for ONE FREE BEER. Ninety percent of the people who rode this were not trying to start a cycling revolution -- they wanted ONE free beer.

(This is no disrespect on East End by the way -- their beer is tops!)

I could go on a long rant about this, but I'd just say what's already been said. Plain and simple: this ride was dumb. Blocking traffic in this manner is just dumb.

Anyway, I'm gunna to go put my spandex on and ride as fast as I can now ...

"Ninety percent of the people who rode this were not trying to start a cycling revolution -- they wanted ONE free beer."

Maybe we should poll the riders as to why they went on this ride. If I could hazard a guess, most would place getting a free beer below the "fun" and "community" aspects of the ride.

You could say that it was a dumb ride because it dissents with the method used by the majority of travelers on the road, irritated the auto drivers on the road, and inconvenienced them to some degree, but then you could say that JCME's comment is dumb because it dissents with the majority of users on this message board and irritates me (and I'm guessing others too). Or, you could say that JCME is just representing himself and speaking his mind, as is his right. Either way, I'm bummed that I missed the ride, it looks like a lot of fun.

"Ninety percent of the people who rode this were not trying to start a cycling revolution -- they wanted ONE free beer."

Maybe we should poll the riders as to why they went on this ride. If I could hazard a guess, most would place getting a free beer below the "fun" and "community" aspects of the ride.

This will be my last post on this subject, but, how many people showed up for critical mass last month? I wasn't there (I could rant, but all I'll say is critical mass is equally silly and counter-productive), but I bet there weren't 500. I bet there weren't 75.

500+ show up for ONE free beer.

75 show up for monthly "cycling revolution."

dude. it was a fun ride. i met lots of people, had good conversation. maybe 2 drivers were irritated. that's about as many irritated drivers that i get when i ride alone. the journey was the destination, not the free beer.

i should also note that i've never had any drivers give me the thumbs up or get huge smiles across their faces when the see me riding alone.

for those who like things that are fun, here's a fun video made of the ride. during one scene where the video is sped up to show all of the riders, in the time it took for 500 people to pass, you can count all of 5 cars that went the other direction.

http://www.vimeo.com/4680534