BIKEPGH MESSAGE BOARD ARCHIVE

nick - which part of the trail are you talking about? the part north from millvale, or the new paved part, or what?

the brand new elevated concrete trail between milvale and 31st street.

So it's not construction incompetence but design incompetence.

because crowning it like a country road or designing it with a 5º out-slope to the river side like properly built single track would have been too hard?

walking on it didn't notice anything, but riding on it... it's as bad as potholes. maybe worse, because potholes have the potential to be fixed.

At the same time, if the alternative is no trail, or an annual mud pit, I'll take the bumps. If there's no alternative that is nice and flat and affordable, that is.

5% out-slope is the alternative. there is a reason that it's the imba standard for sustainable single track. no reason it shouldn't be used on rail trails too. when walking or riding you don't notice that the trail isn't actually level, but it provided enough slope for water to run off the trail without pooling while keeping it slow enough that you don't cause erosion from the runoff.

5% is huge (though probably correct for hand-built dirt trails). For instance, here

The trail could still be fixed by adding asphalt.

Here's hoping that when it does need some form of maintenance down the road, maybe they fix it then. I'm still too overwhelmingly glad it exists to be overly miffed. If it was my commute, I might have bigger issues with it (once a month annoyance on a joy ride is different than daily required annoyance).

yeah for the paved sections 5% is probably overkill, but i was thinking more about the poorly designed dirt and crushed limestone sections that have huge puddles in them and/or get washed out every spring. it they built them properly drainage wouldnt be an issue.

Funny, this is actually "intelligent" design. I agree, riding over it, especially at speed, is not pleasant. However, if the irregularities in the surface meas that it will a) repel water ore easily and therefore be less prone to the development of ice and b)last significantly longer due to the reduction in water collection, I am happy to ride the rumblestrip like connection. The application of asphalt or other "ride smoothing" material would eliminate the benefits inherent in the design. Besides, is anyone on that stretch for more and about a minute at a time?

that's all fine and good, but it's a rather annoying minute. it's especially annoying because they built it for bikes but made it annoying to ride a bike on. couple that fact with the knowledge that other, less irritating, methods exist to accomplish those goals, and i don't think i'm being ungrateful for being dissatisfied with the results.

I'm not real sure what, if anything, can be done about this, but let's keep it in mind for any future projects, that it'd be very helpful to have a smooth ride, in addition to whatever other specs are in there.

Like everyone else, I didn't know we needed to specify this in the plans. (When designing a GUI, one normally does not need to specify not to have red text on a green background, as a comparison.)

I am one of the commuters that experience the rumble strips every day. Yes, they are annoying but the section is very short. What really annoys me is the graffiti that has recently been spraypainted on it.

Also, looking forward to the improvements to the areas before and after the bridge as mentioned in todays post-gazette.

northside trail needs a legal wall or at least a "look the other way" wall like the jail trail. artists are generally more than happy to stick to a highly visible surface that wont get buffed out constantly.

Didn't they paint over a bunch of graffiti on the jail trail? I don't get the point in spending time painting over and washing out that stuff. "Oh no! Not an unapproved message!"

I'm far more annoyed by seeing beer advertisements and all the other garbage Lamar has all over the place, but I don't go painting over their billboards.

Also annoying that amongst the painted over stuff by the jail trail is that mediocre sprout funded art of people walking by. So it's okay to have approved, funded art there by a non-profit, but some guy just walking up and doing it isn't.

at least during the murphy administration that wall was sanctioned as a legal spot to paint. i'm betting the kid mayor "fixed" that while trying to use the "redd up pittsburgh" campaign to suck up to the people who liked o'connor (you know, instead of being honest or doing his damn job)

Here's a design not considered good (or even acceptable) by most cyclists

It wasn't sanctioned. The letter from the Murphy Administration (and the response I got when I called to report vandalism in progress) was that the concrete abutments along the Eliza Furnace Trail belonged to PennDOT and thus were the responsibility of the State Police. The city wasn't going to spend the money policing state property.

I hate to talk bad on any cycling oriented project. I am very happy that these trails get put in but the bumps are pretty annoying. I just hope they learn something form that construction project and we can laugh at the stupid bumpy bridge in the future. I am pretty sure it was not on purpose and they are trying to cover up a mistake.

Bumpy bridge was definitely the result of an intentional design concept -- to rid the elevated section of trail from standing water as quickly and efficiently as possible, among other things. No one is trying to cover up a mistake. But yes, perhaps PennDOT will see things differently next time through.

What doesn't make sense is that the did mill down the larger gaps near the big expansion dams every few pieces, but not these small ruts. I don't buy the drainage argument, though I could easily see that being a top-down explanation given to all the workers. As narrow as it is, and with both sides giving clear drainage, minimal slope is needed. Especially a 'slope' that just sends all the liquid to the nearest joint, where it can freeze and push things apart. *facepalm*

I'll live with it. I'm more curious to see how often this floods. Swalfoort, would this have been underwater in the January 1996 flood?

Can somebody post a picture of what exactly we're talking about here?